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Post by champair79 on Aug 9, 2020 15:40:23 GMT
I thought I’d create a new thread for the Pakistan series.
So, one test is done and what a game of test cricket! England showed some character to come back from a very weak position to win the first test. There are two more games to go in the series - both in Southampton this time. What do we think the team will be and what needs to change for England (and Pakistan...)?
Ben Stokes has been ruled out for the rest of the series for family reasons. So the argument that the batting was weak in the last test has got a whole lot more real for Southampton. Simply recalling Crawley leaves the batting at best the same as the test at Old Trafford. Do England call up another batsman in addition to Crawley or pick some useful lower order bowlers and hedge their bets?
And then the bowlers. Does Dom Bess keep his place? I guess that depends on the pitch. It’s been a lot hotter in the south over the last few days so the pitch might be rock hard. Chris Woakes surely has to be in the side as much for his batting as bowling as does Stuart Broad. Then it’s the whole Archer/Anderson conundrum. I’d be tempted to leave Jimmy out for this test and let him recuperate in time for the final test. Vaughan was saying he looked a bit stiff and old in the field. Maybe a recall for Sam Curran especially as a left hander. Plus he’s useful with the bat too.
My team:
Burns Sibley Crawley Root Pope Buttler Woakes S Curran Bess Archer Broad
Thoughts?
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imp566
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Post by imp566 on Aug 9, 2020 16:15:16 GMT
I think that team looks fine. Curran adds a left arm option and some strength to the batting order. The only spot I would query is Bess. I'm yet to be convinced by him with either bat or ball. It's quite telling that he and Leach both play for Somerset, who prefer Leach over his younger colleague. I'd be tempted to go with the left arm option personally.
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nutsaboutamber
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Post by nutsaboutamber on Aug 9, 2020 19:06:14 GMT
This sounds bloody ironic but Buttler and Woakes are still too high. And Warne made the point the other day that English bowlers who bat a bit from time to time are all rounders all of a sudden! Anderson can be 'rested'. I really don't like the look of Bess - Somerset even loaned him out last year - although Leach is still a bit 'Gilesey' for me but all those right handers suggest left arm would be the better option. I hear though that the England camp 'like' Bess so he'll be in. When does Lawrence get a go?
I bet Azhar Ali is relieved he's not going back to Pakistan today. I fear actually the tourists might be a bit traumatised after the way events unfurled yesterday afternoon. That said, their backroom team is pretty impressive!
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Post by champair79 on Aug 9, 2020 22:31:46 GMT
It's quite telling that he and Leach both play for Somerset, who prefer Leach over his younger colleague. I'd be tempted to go with the left arm option personally. I’m a big fan of Jack Leach especially when he was doing the business last summer. For some reason the England coaching staff prefer Bess. Is Leach still with the squad or has he been released to play in the Bob Willis trophy? The alternative is to go with no spinner (use Root if you have to) and put another batsman in instead of Bess? Personally although I think Buttler and Woakes are one place too high, all of the bowlers can bat a bit. Look at Pakistan - they have 3 genuine number 11s at 9/10/11 albeit they have a quality 1-5. I agree with Shane Warne about England’s batting but when they can all bat to some extent, you have to gamble a bit and assume one or two of them will score a solid 20 or 30. You then get the variety with the bowling lineup as well. Just my two cents.
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Post by Tom Shaw's Fist of Rage on Aug 9, 2020 22:41:44 GMT
Think with Broad's return to batting form we can just about to afford to have Woakes as the all rounder, if Bess stays & Curran comes in for Jimmy we end up batting very deep.
Would be a shame if Jimmy fizzles out so hope he rests up and bowls well in the test he plays. I think it would be foolish to put it in the minds of the selectors not to take him to India. Concerns about his age but if anything he's too fit & bowling too fast, where he's proven to be a lot more effective bowling low 80s recently.
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nutsaboutamber
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Favourite CUFC player: Brian Greenhalgh
Favourite CUFC match: Maidstone(a) at Dartford, playoff semi final 2nd leg, 16 May 1990
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Post by nutsaboutamber on Aug 10, 2020 17:53:43 GMT
I'll put this out there Buttler at six and Foakes at seven. Plus Archer is being rotated(out).
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cambsno
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Post by cambsno on Aug 11, 2020 7:45:42 GMT
I think that team looks fine. Curran adds a left arm option and some strength to the batting order. The only spot I would query is Bess. I'm yet to be convinced by him with either bat or ball. It's quite telling that he and Leach both play for Somerset, who prefer Leach over his younger colleague. I'd be tempted to go with the left arm option personally. Bess has had some great knocks with the bat! Woakes must have sealed his place as the 3rd seamer behind Anderson & Broad, personally prefer Wood over Archer, while I dont doubt Archers talent he is overhyped. Tempted to put in a proper keeper and play Buttler as a pure batsman.
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yorkie
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Post by yorkie on Aug 11, 2020 10:48:07 GMT
I think that team looks fine. Curran adds a left arm option and some strength to the batting order. The only spot I would query is Bess. I'm yet to be convinced by him with either bat or ball. It's quite telling that he and Leach both play for Somerset, who prefer Leach over his younger colleague. I'd be tempted to go with the left arm option personally. Bess has had some great knocks with the bat! Woakes must have sealed his place as the 3rd seamer behind Anderson & Broad, personally prefer Wood over Archer, while I dont doubt Archers talent he is overhyped. Tempted to put in a proper keeper and play Buttler as a pure batsman. I would drop Archer...agree, currently not good enough and rated too highly. Anderson needs dropping. I believe that the decision to not play many more tests will not be on his terms. There must be a lot of players out in the county that should be given a chance. Must admit I'm a curran fan and being left arm gives the team an alternative. Not sure on Bess....at times he looks so far off being a good slow bowler. The wicket keeper is a problem. The reaction time of Buttler when standing up is not good enough. Just watch in slow motion.
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Post by Tom Shaw's Fist of Rage on Aug 11, 2020 13:46:31 GMT
Problem with Curran is that at his pace he'll likely continue to struggle outside England.
Archer is clearly good enough, his record to date shows that & will be useful down-under, he was overused last winter & probably under utilised this summer, there's also the issue that now we know he can bowl 95mph we kind of always expect that even if the pitch & the conditions aren't suitable.
Bess is clearly a case of not having any great spinners so sticking with the one who can bat the best.
Buttler's keeping isn't a problem in white ball nor was it a big issue before this test - he needs to go away and get his mojo back with the gloves, his experience & clutch ability is enough to keep him in the side at the moment but not enough as a specialist batsman.
Anderson perhaps need a rest, but one bad test shouldn't define a player & if we held his catches he would have an average this summer of under 25 added to his winter average of 19 & there would be no questions at all about his place. I know who I'd trust to lead the attack in India.
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nutsaboutamber
Reserve team regular
Posts: 3,902
Favourite CUFC player: Brian Greenhalgh
Favourite CUFC match: Maidstone(a) at Dartford, playoff semi final 2nd leg, 16 May 1990
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Post by nutsaboutamber on Aug 12, 2020 18:30:42 GMT
I bet that India tour is looking suspect already. I see they've already dumped a test to make way for the other rubbish in the schedule.
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Post by champair79 on Aug 12, 2020 20:30:39 GMT
From Root’s comments, it looks like Jimmy will play tomorrow. No bad thing but I think I’d still have preferred him to rest for this test and come back fresh for the third test.
In other news, Stuart Broad fined by his Dad for bad language in the last test 😁
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tommy
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Post by tommy on Aug 13, 2020 4:54:25 GMT
From Root’s comments, it looks like Jimmy will play tomorrow. No bad thing but I think I’d still have preferred him to rest for this test and come back fresh for the third test. In other news, Stuart Broad fined by his Dad for bad language in the last test 😁 Yeah, so Crawley in for Stokes. If Jimmy plays, can’t see any of Archer, Broad or Woakes being dropped. Maybe Bess, but would always want a spinner.
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imp566
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Post by imp566 on Aug 13, 2020 19:25:46 GMT
Today's gone well, despite the weather (Ironically, if they'd stayed in Manchester they would have got a full days play in!)
Need to get Babar out early tomorrow then roll over the tail. If we bat well, this game could be over by Sunday at tea, although weather remains questionable throughout.
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Post by champair79 on Aug 21, 2020 8:00:08 GMT
So test match two was a disappointment with the rain and bad light issues.
Thankfully (with the exception of today), the weather for the third test looks much better. If you were Joe (or Azhar Ali), would you look to continue the squad rotation or keep a similar team to the second test bearing in mind all the players will be fresh?
It’s good to see earlier start times being considered especially when there are no fans. I find it disappointing that the ICC aren’t taking a lead on these issues and instead wait for pundits and the media to moan before anything is done (see the no ball debate with the third umpire).
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Post by dincey99 on Aug 21, 2020 8:58:39 GMT
So test match two was a disappointment with the rain and bad light issues. Thankfully (with the exception of today), the weather for the third test looks much better. If you were Joe (or Azhar Ali), would you look to continue the squad rotation or keep a similar team to the second test bearing in mind all the players will be fresh? It’s good to see earlier start times being considered especially when there are no fans. I find it disappointing that the ICC aren’t taking a lead on these issues and instead wait for pundits and the media to moan before anything is done (see the no ball debate with the third umpire). Archer in for Curran would be my only change and hope we win the toss. Another CB9 postcode
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