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Post by hoolaohanrahanrahan on Feb 9, 2024 22:43:39 GMT
Ehhh abuse is part of the game, cross a line get a yellow and that's that.
Not sure it's worth an over the top solution like this when a dose of HTFU would also do the job.
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Post by martinjohn on Feb 10, 2024 9:14:22 GMT
I really don't understand why people are saying football should be more like rugby or more like ice hockey. Football should be more like football. Its a different culture to those sports - is generally seen as a working class sport unlike ruggers. And I imagine you'd need a lot of money to be an ice hockey player too. We have a system, it works. Dissent will still happen, but generally footballers are much better behaved than previous generations. We don't need the game to be meddled with any more than it has been. Wow so being working class entitles you to verbally or physically abuse a ref or in essence a fellow human being. I'm most definitely working class but I'm glad my moral compass points in the right direction. Not what I'm saying, but if attacking a straw man makes you feel good then go for it. I'm saying that football should evolve on its own terms, not try to be more like other sports. If a player verbally abuses or physically abuses a ref they should be dealt with a yellow or red card - the system already exists, just needs to be used consistently.
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Post by mikelan on Feb 10, 2024 9:45:30 GMT
I use to think the use of a sin bin like they do in Rugby would be a good idea in footbal. When thy put mics on rugby referees, you can hear the ref all the time speaking to players, telling them they are infringing or about to, constantly giving feedback to players. This keeps the game flowing unless the player takes no notice, then the ref warns him or sends him to the sin bin. Most of the play in rugby is in a discreet area of the field unlike football when play in the defensive area can be suddenly moved to a wing position in the opponents half, the ref is uanble to give feed back to players as he is concentrating on keeping up with play. I now believe that referee's should apply the laws as they stand, making it clear they are acting on what they see, not what anyone else see's. As a referee will tel you, she/he can only award some sort of penalty if they see an infringemnet. it comes down to playersshowing respect to the ref. For players, that is not easy when you can see a win/goal scoring bonus going down the swanneee.
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TallPaddy
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,017
Favourite CUFC player: tom finney
Favourite CUFC match: Arsenal away Fa cup
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Post by TallPaddy on Feb 10, 2024 9:50:29 GMT
I know there is the whole 'players are fired up' so dissent will happen. I do feel that is complete nonsense. Players get just as fired up in other sports but don't mouth of at the ref/umpire to the same extent. You cannot be serious? I so hope I've read that right! Very funny if I have.
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Post by martinjohn on Feb 10, 2024 9:59:10 GMT
I so hope I've read that right! Very funny if I have. Wohooo!!! I thought it would get noticed quicker than it has, but thank you!
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foolhandy
Youth team star
Posts: 1,151
Favourite CUFC player: Spriggs. Dublin. Pitt. Lennett.
Favourite CUFC match: vs Leicester C (H) 1982. Without that...?
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Post by foolhandy on Feb 10, 2024 10:08:16 GMT
If you get a blue card in the 89th minute do you have to sit out the first 9 minutes of the next game? If there are 5 minutes of extra time is the next game sin bin time reduced by 5 minutes? All ball cocks. Just use the yellow card properly.
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pgtips (lurid)
Youth team substitute
Scattered thoughts, but thoughts nonetheless
Posts: 694
Favourite CUFC player: Dion Dublin
Favourite CUFC match: 2-0 Vs Pish 22/23
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Post by pgtips (lurid) on Feb 11, 2024 11:44:32 GMT
Observations from a colleague at work who is a ref at Thurlow Nunn Premier (formerly the Eastern Counties League) level and Norfolk FA`s Official Of The Year 2023......... He`s been using the sin bin for dissent as part of the FA`s trial and is a big fan as he reckons it`s reduced "gobbing off" massively. FWIW his technique is to talk to the captain at the occurence of the first offence and basically say `Have a word with your number 4 cos if he mouths off to me again he`ll be off for ten`. 90% of the time this works a treat - in his words it`s self-policing. However , he is most definitely NOT in favour of the sin bin for "cynical fouls" as these are way more subjective and open to interpretation than a player telling the ref that he`s an Evans. Therein lies the problem... He should be booked for 'gobbing off' the first time and then the problem is dealt with. Quite. The warning to captains should be before the match, either in the "tunnel" or a note to the dressing room. Refs clearly can't justify to themselves applying a yellow card for the milder forms of dissent. Understandable if a player gets double yellow for talking himself into the book. Players already get sin binned for half a minute for being injured (!!) so it has to be more than that. Shithousing managers might even have a blue card policy ready for acceptable binning to monster the ref. There are plenty of offences that warrant half a yellow card. I'd rather the blue card meant that. A player on a yellow and a blue would probably get subbed off or be on such thin ice that they behave or sink. A group of players surrounding the ref to argue a decision could ALL pick up a blue card without it ruining the match.
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lionel
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,145
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Post by lionel on Feb 11, 2024 12:15:22 GMT
I play both hockey and football so have experience of the sin-bin. It doesn't impact the structure of the game as much as you may think. A blue card punishment will stop at the end of the match and not roll over to the next. If it's the keeper then an outfield player will need to take the gloves. Arguably, a goalkeeper being sin binned in hockey causes alot more hassle than football.
Hockey has a green card (2 min sin-bin), yellow card (5 min sin-bin) and red card (off for rest of match). The green card was only recently changed to a sin-bin from previously being just a warning card.
The green card being a sin-bin card has reduced dissent massively. The sin bin has prevented players getting further punishment as it gives time to cool down.
The yellow card is just not a massive deterrent to reduce dissent. Ultimately, the blue card will only come into play if dissent is given so it is player responsibility.
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Post by zx10racer22 on Feb 11, 2024 17:14:57 GMT
I am going to confidently predict the long term effect of this rule change will be somebody, it years to come, saying "do you remember back in 2024 when someone thought it would be good to have a blue card and it never went anywhere?"
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Amba Gambla
Youth team substitute
We're too good to go down!
Posts: 463
Favourite CUFC player: Steve Spriggs
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Blue card
Feb 12, 2024 17:16:19 GMT
via mobile
Post by Amba Gambla on Feb 12, 2024 17:16:19 GMT
Sorry but I have a hankering for a blue card. Not because I think it'll add anything to the game, but purely to piss off premiershite managers like Klopp 😉
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Post by abbey88 on Feb 13, 2024 16:48:28 GMT
Perhaps they should at first, try using the tools already at their disposal? Start sending players off for dissent and cynical play and the problem will soon disappear.
Captains should be the only player allowed to talk to the ref.
VAR and other tech should only be used by default for definitive decisions, offside, goal-line. For other fouls/incidents the captain has two opportunities per game to ask for the ref's decision to be reviewed via VAR. When asking for the review he has to be very specific in what he wants reviewed ie handball, push in back etc, etc.
simple :-)
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Lurid
Reserve team star
Unita in conatu
Posts: 5,045
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Post by Lurid on Feb 16, 2024 11:48:03 GMT
I so hope I've read that right! Very funny if I have. Wohooo!!! I thought it would get noticed quicker than it has, but thank you! I think quite a few of us spotted the John McEnroe quote, but only TallPaddy was generous to acknowledge it. So props to him for being a good sport. In terms of the debate, the infante terrible of tennis is/was the exception that proves the rule.
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