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Post by saltyvinegar on Jun 10, 2024 10:25:39 GMT
Argentina won the world cup with Otamendi at centre back. Our current back 4 is more than good enough if we are coached correctly and set up to play to our strengths True but FIFA loved Messi & wanted the poster boy to collect the trophy (dressed in a mosquito net) Don't think we are liked as much so never seem to be on the right end of any crucial "decisions"
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jwills61
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Post by jwills61 on Jun 10, 2024 11:01:01 GMT
I see us going out in the semis to France.
But the squad is good enough to win it. Worse teams have won it.
As others have said, the back line worries me a bit but it’s not insurmountable.
I think getting Shaw up to speed for the knockouts could be make or break because we’re lacking width on that left side.
I also think Southgate is gonna have to be bold at times. Putting the best 11 players on the pitch doesn’t automatically make it your best team.
I think Foden is world class but Jude should take priority at CAM and playing from the left isn’t Foden’s strongest position.
There’s gonna be times where it needs to be a Gordon etc to stretch the defence and run in behind on the left. This matters less if we have a fit Shaw holding the width on the left, however.
I think it’s easy to get lost in cramming your best players into the side and not focusing on the balance the team needs to be effective.
If Kane drops deep and Saka is cutting in from the left to get the ball into feet, that means someone on that left side needs to be holding the width and running in behind or it’ll all get too congested and we’ll spend too much time playing in front of the back line.
I’d have taken Rashford instead of Bowen, even though his form has been poor. Saka, Palmer, Bowen (and arguably Foden) are all best cutting onto their left from the right.
We need a direct runner on the other side to make us dangerous. It can’t all be on Jude and Kane making late runs centrally.
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Post by funkymonk on Jun 10, 2024 11:43:38 GMT
Argentina won the world cup with Otamendi at centre back. Our current back 4 is more than good enough if we are coached correctly and set up to play to our strengths True but FIFA loved Messi & wanted the poster boy to collect the trophy (dressed in a mosquito net) Don't think we are liked as much so never seem to be on the right end of any crucial "decisions" Been hanging out with Arsenal fans? We definitely didn't get a soft penalty in the semi finals last time out either, or two penalties in the World Cup...
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Post by saltyvinegar on Jun 10, 2024 12:03:28 GMT
True but FIFA loved Messi & wanted the poster boy to collect the trophy (dressed in a mosquito net) Don't think we are liked as much so never seem to be on the right end of any crucial "decisions" Been hanging out with Arsenal fans? We definitely didn't get a soft penalty in the semi finals last time out either, or two penalties in the World Cup... Dodgy Ref against France needed VAR to give the blatant one against Mount, missed the foul on Saka before the French goal & missed a possible penalty against Kane. That's just one game, never mind 1986 QF, 1998 R16, 2004 QF, 2010 R16...
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simon
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Post by simon on Jun 10, 2024 12:43:24 GMT
“Could we do with a Grealish or a Maddison now?”
65th minute v Serbia with the score at 0-0
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Post by funkymonk on Jun 10, 2024 12:55:12 GMT
Been hanging out with Arsenal fans? We definitely didn't get a soft penalty in the semi finals last time out either, or two penalties in the World Cup... Dodgy Ref against France needed VAR to give the blatant one against Mount, missed the foul on Saka before the French goal & missed a possible penalty against Kane. That's just one game, never mind 1986 QF, 1998 R16, 2004 QF, 2010 R16... 2004 still rankles, 2010 was a terrible decision but we were getting our battyholes torn apart either way there. Besides, my point was just that it's probably not a conspiracy, Richie Hanlon's razor and all that.
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lionel
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Post by lionel on Jun 10, 2024 14:29:12 GMT
Personally, I think we are going to win it. Good mix and with some top players. The palace lads bring a refreshing enthusiasm to it. If you take the emotion out; a team which includes Kyle Walker, John Stones, Declan Rice, Phil Foden, Cole Palmer, Jude Bellingham and Harry Kane is going to compete. And it doesn't matter if the first few games are boring and we grind out 1-0 wins etc... It's a long tournament and plenty of oppurtunity to show your form. Wharton is a potential star and has really benefitted from his loan spell with us! Wrong one, that’s his brother Trouble is we overrate our players as world class to easily. Foden does well for citeh but has not really shown much for England. Bellingham was on fire earlier in the season but less so now. Also the squad seems a bit fragile with many already carrying knocks Yep; exclamation mark... I think Greece showed that anyone is capable of winning. I can genuinely say that Jude and Harry would be in my world 11.
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Post by zx10racer22 on Jun 10, 2024 14:36:57 GMT
Sol Campbell's disallowed goal in 2004 still hurts. There was nothing wrong with it.
Especially after having a very similar issue 6 years earlier against Argentina.
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Post by funkymonk on Jun 10, 2024 14:38:20 GMT
Wrong one, that’s his brother Trouble is we overrate our players as world class to easily. Foden does well for citeh but has not really shown much for England. Bellingham was on fire earlier in the season but less so now. Also the squad seems a bit fragile with many already carrying knocks Yep; exclamation mark... I think Greece showed that anyone is capable of winning. I can genuinely say that Jude and Harry would be in my world 11. Greece, Denmark when they didn't even qualify, or even that Portugal side in 2016 who should have been out multiple times but spwaned it home over the line. Lump on the Scotch or Albanians then!
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malotru
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Post by malotru on Jun 10, 2024 17:25:41 GMT
The first choice XI for 2004 is by far the best England team on paper I’ve seen in my lifetime with Rooney at his absolute peak.
Maybe a proper left sided midfielder rather than shoe horning Scholes there but loosing in the quarters once Rooney went off was so disappointing.
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Post by zx10racer22 on Jun 10, 2024 18:55:05 GMT
The first choice XI for 2004 is by far the best England team on paper I’ve seen in my lifetime with Rooney at his absolute peak. Maybe a proper left sided midfielder rather than shoe horning Scholes there but loosing in the quarters once Rooney went off was so disappointing. Wrong tournament. Rooney was sent off in the 2006 World Cup
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danboyb
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Post by danboyb on Jun 10, 2024 19:00:28 GMT
The first choice XI for 2004 is by far the best England team on paper I’ve seen in my lifetime with Rooney at his absolute peak. Maybe a proper left sided midfielder rather than shoe horning Scholes there but loosing in the quarters once Rooney went off was so disappointing. Wrong tournament. Rooney was sent off in the 2006 World Cup Think Mal was referring to Rooney going off injured v Portugal in 04
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lionel
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Post by lionel on Jun 10, 2024 19:41:26 GMT
Sol Campbell's disallowed goal in 2004 still hurts. There was nothing wrong with it. Especially after having a very similar issue 6 years earlier against Argentina. Don't get me started. It was a clear goal against Argentina. Given that it would have been a golden goal we legit won the game. Still fuming.
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malotru
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Post by malotru on Jun 10, 2024 20:27:38 GMT
Wrong tournament. Rooney was sent off in the 2006 World Cup Think Mal was referring to Rooney going off injured v Portugal in 04 Yes, he went off with a broken foot or something similar and replaced by Darius Vassell. Rooney was just unplayable in 04 I don’t think it’s unreasonable to say had he stayed fit, we would have won it. I couldn’t watch the 06 penalty shoot out and I went and sat outside and sat on the curb waiting for the inevitable groans from inside the pub.
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Post by flouncingarburyboy on Jun 10, 2024 21:16:33 GMT
I can't believe Euro 96 hasn't been mentioned so far (it probably has hasn't it?). A great team but also the first time I thought we could genuinely win something. And Venables. And that sudden death stuff (great) and that penalty shoot outs (less great). What a summer.
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