imp566
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Post by imp566 on Jul 11, 2024 7:15:40 GMT
Outside of the penalty area, that challenge is a foul in every match you watch. The challenge was late (he didn't get the ball) and studs first. Where it is on the pitch has no bearing to the outcome.
I cringed when I heard Gary Neville say that he believes there should be more allowance given to that sort of tackle in the penalty area! A true defender talking!
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Post by saltyvinegar on Jul 11, 2024 8:02:36 GMT
I think we are judging the penalty decision on EFL/PL norms but in Europe, you cannot raise your foot with studs showing at an unnatural height for tacking without risking a foul being given against you. A foul should be judged the same in any area of the pitch but often isn't. We've all seen fouls given at tournaments when a player tackles at at a similar height & actually wins the ball first but is still penalised for a studs high challenge. The pundits like Neville are "refereeing" the game based on their own sentiments & memories
Anyway it was given & I'll take it as we were the better side over the 90mins & really should have put it to bed in the 1st half
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Post by artvandelay on Jul 11, 2024 8:49:35 GMT
It's not a foul anywhere in the pitch. His foot wasn't high, Kane had his foot just as high and he kicked the defender, surely that's dangerous too! Nobody reacted at all until Kane did his usual routine. He knew exactly what he was doing: make it seem worse, stop the goal-kick being taken and then was miraculously up on his feet when the decision was made. That sort of behaviour is one of the many things that make the game so hard to watch and he is as bad as I've seen for it.
Actually, having watched it again, the handball by Saka should make the whole debate regarding the foul irrelevant!
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danboyb
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Post by danboyb on Jul 11, 2024 9:08:16 GMT
Penalty, no penalty, who cares. I’m sure Graham Taylor is looking down with a huge grin on his face.
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Post by artvandelay on Jul 11, 2024 9:11:13 GMT
Penalty, no penalty, who cares. I’m sure Graham Taylor is looking down with a huge grin on his face. Because of the game that Rijkaard was a victim of one of the worst ever offside calls and the Dutch should have had a penalty? It was great sportsmanship from David Seaman to stand by the corner flag and let Koeman score the resultant free-kick though!
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imp566
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Post by imp566 on Jul 11, 2024 9:11:41 GMT
It's not a foul anywhere in the pitch. His foot wasn't high, Kane had his foot just as high and he kicked the defender, surely that's dangerous too! Nobody reacted at all until Kane did his usual routine. He knew exactly what he was doing: make it seem worse, stop the goal-kick being taken and then was miraculously up on his feet when the decision was made. That sort of behaviour is one of the many things that make the game so hard to watch and he is as bad as I've seen for it. Actually, having watched it again, the handball by Saka should make the whole debate regarding the foul irrelevant! Did the Dutch player touch the ball in the challenge - No, Kane got there first Was it a studs first challenge? Yes. Both of those facts are enough to meet the threshold for a foul, inside the penalty area or anywhere on the pitch. You may not like it, but that is what the Law states. Law 12: A direct free kick (or penalty) is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force. Tackles or challenges - Reckless is when a player acts with disregard to the danger to, or consequences for, an opponent and must be cautioned Subjective as always, but that type of offence is considered reckless if they don't get the ball.
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Post by artvandelay on Jul 11, 2024 9:17:40 GMT
It's not a foul anywhere in the pitch. His foot wasn't high, Kane had his foot just as high and he kicked the defender, surely that's dangerous too! Nobody reacted at all until Kane did his usual routine. He knew exactly what he was doing: make it seem worse, stop the goal-kick being taken and then was miraculously up on his feet when the decision was made. That sort of behaviour is one of the many things that make the game so hard to watch and he is as bad as I've seen for it. Actually, having watched it again, the handball by Saka should make the whole debate regarding the foul irrelevant! Did the Dutch player touch the ball in the challenge - No, Kane got there first Was it a studs first challenge? Yes. Both of those facts are enough to meet the threshold for a foul, inside the penalty area or anywhere on the pitch. You may not like it, but that is what the Law states. Law 12: A direct free kick (or penalty) is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force. Tackles or challenges - Reckless is when a player acts with disregard to the danger to, or consequences for, an opponent and must be cautioned Subjective as always, but that type of offence is considered reckless if they don't get the ball. I'm well aware of the laws. I don't think that's even near reckless. We may as well just book any player who even tries to challenge. As I said above, Saka's handball should have made the debate redundant anyway.
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Post by Andrewlang on Jul 11, 2024 9:25:54 GMT
"Because of the game that Rijkaard was a victim of one of the worst ever offside calls and the Dutch should have had a penalty? It was great sportsmanship from David Seaman to stand by the corner flag and let Koeman score the resultant free-kick though!"
'He’s going to flip one now! He’s going to flip one! He’s going to flip one – and it’s in!'
Still gives me sleepless nights that does. I wake up in a cold damp sweat screaming "Do I not like that" and "Just saying to your colleague the referees just got me the sack".
Andrew
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onlyluke92
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Post by onlyluke92 on Jul 11, 2024 9:30:34 GMT
Did the Dutch player touch the ball in the challenge - No, Kane got there first Was it a studs first challenge? Yes. Both of those facts are enough to meet the threshold for a foul, inside the penalty area or anywhere on the pitch. You may not like it, but that is what the Law states. Law 12: A direct free kick (or penalty) is awarded if a player commits any of the following offences against an opponent in a manner considered by the referee to be careless, reckless or using excessive force. Tackles or challenges - Reckless is when a player acts with disregard to the danger to, or consequences for, an opponent and must be cautioned Subjective as always, but that type of offence is considered reckless if they don't get the ball. I'm well aware of the laws. I don't think that's even near reckless. We may as well just book any player who even tries to challenge. As I said above, Saka's handball should have made the debate redundant anyway. Which also should never be given as a handball offence, it comes up off of his body and onto his hand. What was he meant to do?
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Post by artvandelay on Jul 11, 2024 9:37:40 GMT
I'm well aware of the laws. I don't think that's even near reckless. We may as well just book any player who even tries to challenge. As I said above, Saka's handball should have made the debate redundant anyway. Which also should never be given as a handball offence, it comes up off of his body and onto his hand. What was he meant to do? Initially, he then moved his hand out to control it. It's instinctive but is deliberate handball.
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Post by Andrewlang on Jul 11, 2024 9:41:17 GMT
I thought the penalty was harsh tbf. You can see why it would be given according to the game laws but I don't really want to see them given for that, it's a very easy one to pick apart, isn't it.
I'll cut Kane a little slack for the theatrics because I'm sure getting booted on the ankle probably hurts regardless of whether it's a penalty or not.
...but ultimately you can ignore all that guff because I just don't care. I'm not going to remember that 30 years from now in the same way I remember Koeman trying to garot Platt. Or 40 years ago when Madonna punched the ball into the net. Or 14 years ago when goal line technology had to be introduced to wipe out salty tears after Lampard had a clear goal against Germany ruled out.
Happy to live in ignorant bliss and enjoy the final on Sunday 🦁🦁🦁.
Andrew
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imp566
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Post by imp566 on Jul 11, 2024 9:47:52 GMT
I thought the penalty was harsh tbf. You can see why it would be given according to the game laws but I don't really want to see them given for that, it's a very easy one to pick apart, isn't it. I'll cut Kane a little slack for the theatrics because I'm sure getting booted on the ankle probably hurts regardless of whether it's a penalty or not. ...but ultimately you can ignore all that guff because I just don't care. I'm not going to remember that 30 years from now in the same way I remember Koeman trying to garot Platt. Or 40 years ago when Madonna punched the ball into the net. Or 14 years ago when goal line technology had to be introduced to wipe out salty tears after Lampard had a clear goal against Germany ruled out. Happy to live in ignorant bliss and enjoy the final on Sunday 🦁🦁🦁. Andrew Amen to all of that. It's football after all, there will always be contentious incidents that decide games and depending on which side of the fence you sit on, will provoke debate and disagreement. The game we love (but maybe not the decisions we see!)
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Post by artvandelay on Jul 11, 2024 9:51:12 GMT
I thought the penalty was harsh tbf. You can see why it would be given according to the game laws but I don't really want to see them given for that, it's a very easy one to pick apart, isn't it. I'll cut Kane a little slack for the theatrics because I'm sure getting booted on the ankle probably hurts regardless of whether it's a penalty or not. ...but ultimately you can ignore all that guff because I just don't care. I'm not going to remember that 30 years from now in the same way I remember Koeman trying to garot Platt. Or 40 years ago when Madonna punched the ball into the net. Or 14 years ago when goal line technology had to be introduced to wipe out salty tears after Lampard had a clear goal against Germany ruled out. Happy to live in ignorant bliss and enjoy the final on Sunday 🦁🦁🦁. Andrew I would cut him a lot more slack if he wasn't at it all the time!
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Post by El Goodo on Jul 11, 2024 9:52:57 GMT
Do think it's pretty funny that Kane will win the Golden Boot if he scores in the final and Olmo doesn't. Also pretty funny if neither score and Olmo wins it with.... 3 goals (+ 2 assists).
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danboyb
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Post by danboyb on Jul 11, 2024 9:57:56 GMT
Kane is doing a job for the team. Sacrificing himself a little bit but when he needs to step up, he does it.
Excellent substitutions again from Southgate. His decisions regarding who to bring on/off and when to do it is a big reason why we are in the final.
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