shubs
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,292
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Post by shubs on Aug 4, 2019 9:53:32 GMT
2 more in the USA in the last 24 hours making it something like 250 so far this calendar year! Absolute carnage. When will that sexist, racist prick Trump do anything about it? Never is the short answer, as he is 100% in league with the gun lobby. Terrifying to think that this utter moron and lunatic is in charge of the most powerful nation in the world.
Rant over. Enjoy your Sunday.
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Post by cufcdenmark on Aug 4, 2019 11:31:00 GMT
Not convinced all the blame can be dumped on Trump. There seems to have been a rise in mass shootings in the last few years (not just under Trump), and it's not like Obama did anything about it in the 8 years he was in power, even though there were hundreds of mass shootings during his presidency.
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Post by eltelsgoldtooth on Aug 4, 2019 11:39:04 GMT
Not convinced all the blame can be dumped on Trump. There seems to have been a rise in mass shootings in the last few years (not just under Trump), and it's not like Obama did anything about it in the 8 years he was in power, even though there were hundreds of mass shootings during his presidency. Spot on. Doesn’t fit the anti trump rhetoric tho
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shubs
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,292
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Post by shubs on Aug 4, 2019 13:33:56 GMT
IIRC Obama tried but failed to take on the gun lobby.
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Post by cufcdenmark on Aug 4, 2019 14:29:25 GMT
IIRC Obama tried but failed to take on the gun lobby. So how do you expect someone as unpopular as Trump to achieve it then?
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shubs
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,292
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Post by shubs on Aug 4, 2019 15:15:26 GMT
IIRC Obama tried but failed to take on the gun lobby. So how do you expect someone as unpopular as Trump to achieve it then? The sad part is that he isn’t unpopular at home, is he? There are enough rednecks and meatheads that support him and make him bullet proof to everything that he is accused of. The bottom line is that the Republicans have relied on support from the Gun Club for years and Trump sure as hell knows how powerful that lobby is. The fact that Trump comes out with nonsense like ‘If the good guys have more guns than the bad guys, then the good guys win,” sums it up perfectly. For him life is like a 3rd rate John Wayne film. Horrifying times we live in.
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Post by cufcdenmark on Aug 4, 2019 15:34:56 GMT
But let's face it, he is accused of everything. If you listen to his detractors, he is guilty of everything from the depression in the 20's and 30's to being the Devil incarnate.
I would worry more about someone like Putin than Trump. Trump can be hindered in his decisions / actions, whereas Putin has full power, and can (and often does) do what he wants.
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shubs
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,292
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Post by shubs on Aug 4, 2019 16:52:35 GMT
Yeah, fair point about Putin, Denmark. He is also a lunatic. However, when you have a President who tells 4 senators to go back to their own country, when 3 of them were born in the US, it creates a climate where racist comments are acceptable and accepted. Then you have all the crap that Trump spouts about Mexicans and building a wall to keep them out. The conclusion of that is the gunman who committed the atrocities in Texas today was apparently a white supremacist who wanted to kill Hispanics. Maybe in his eyes his actions were justified by the words of his President.
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Post by cufcdenmark on Aug 4, 2019 17:28:18 GMT
Again, there have been racist shootings long before Trump took over. Not too sure he wouldn't of done it if Hillary had won the last election. Was the Dayton shooter also a white supremacist?
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Post by lennypack on Aug 4, 2019 18:22:56 GMT
Again, there have been racist shootings long before Trump took over. Not too sure he wouldn't of done it if Hillary had won the last election. Was the Dayton shooter also a white supremacist? Obviously it'll be difficult to pinpoint cause and effect, but what we can know is that Trump's disgusting behaviour can only have made this more likely if anything. His language is horrendously inflammatory and no decent person could consider it acceptable. I say this as someone who is hardly a loony lefty.
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Post by somersetewe on Aug 4, 2019 18:43:20 GMT
To be honest it doesn't matter who is in charge (and I am no Trump supporter), it is the inability to see the link between gun ownership and the level of killings. I think we cannot appreciate the strength of support behind the National Rifle Association, and the 'Right to bear arms'. To us it makes no sense, but the gun lobby is hugely powerful.
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neilmc4
Youth team substitute
Posts: 583
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Post by neilmc4 on Aug 4, 2019 19:31:04 GMT
IIRC Obama tried but failed to take on the gun lobby. 108 gun control Bills put to votes by Obama - every single one defeated by the Republican/NRA alliance. Even moderate checks to stop the seriously mentally ill from owning machine guns voted down. Whatever your views on Trump it is an indisputable fact that neo-Nazis and white supremacists within the US feel empowered and emboldened by his blatant and crude racist rhetoric. The only surprise is that it took this long for the fascist lunatic fringe to start turning his words into body counts. Scary times.
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Mark of Carnage
Reserve team substitute
Responsibility, Resilience, Respect
Posts: 2,558
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Post by Mark of Carnage on Aug 4, 2019 20:17:05 GMT
This is one of those massive cultural differences where GB Shaw's 'UK and USA are 2 nations separated by a common language' comes into play.
Our answer is to have no guns. Their answer is that everyone should have guns to defend themselves against bad doods and in case the British turn up and try to oppress them again.
Taking a purely partisan approach I see this as a uniquely American internal problem and am thankful that I live in a country where this sort of thing is extremly rare.
The irony of calling for the death penalty for this fellow is lost on them. Probably lost on our home sec too but that's another story.
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Post by cufcdenmark on Aug 4, 2019 21:57:10 GMT
IIRC Obama tried but failed to take on the gun lobby. 108 gun control Bills put to votes by Obama - every single one defeated by the Republican/NRA alliance. Even moderate checks to stop the seriously mentally ill from owning machine guns voted down. Whatever your views on Trump it is an indisputable fact that neo-Nazis and white supremacists within the US feel empowered and emboldened by his blatant and crude racist rhetoric. The only surprise is that it took this long for the fascist lunatic fringe to start turning his words into body counts.Scary times. Again, this was happening under Obama as well, so don't see that all the blame can be given to Trump. Well over 200 people were killed in mass shootings under Obama's term of office, I wonder how many of those were race related. Personally I think somersetewe is spot on: " it doesn't matter who is in charge (and I am no Trump supporter), it is the inability to see the link between gun ownership and the level of killings". If you think about all the knife crime we have in England now, and then think what would happen if the perpetrators all had guns instead, then I have no doubt that we would have plenty of mass shootings.
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Post by lennypack on Aug 5, 2019 0:03:14 GMT
108 gun control Bills put to votes by Obama - every single one defeated by the Republican/NRA alliance. Even moderate checks to stop the seriously mentally ill from owning machine guns voted down. Whatever your views on Trump it is an indisputable fact that neo-Nazis and white supremacists within the US feel empowered and emboldened by his blatant and crude racist rhetoric. The only surprise is that it took this long for the fascist lunatic fringe to start turning his words into body counts.Scary times. Again, this was happening under Obama as well, so don't see that all the blame can be given to Trump. Well over 200 people were killed in mass shootings under Obama's term of office, I wonder how many of those were race related. Personally I think somersetewe is spot on: " it doesn't matter who is in charge (and I am no Trump supporter), it is the inability to see the link between gun ownership and the level of killings". If you think about all the knife crime we have in England now, and then think what would happen if the perpetrators all had guns instead, then I have no doubt that we would have plenty of mass shootings. I don't think anyone has placed "all" the blame on Trump. But given that he launched a political career on a racist lie (birtherism), then ran for President by calling Mexicans rapists, then as President spoke repeatedly in terms of Latin American "invasion" of the US, it's hardly a stretch to suggest that he might shoulder *some* of the blame for a shooting targeting Latin Americans by a white nationalist, is it? Let's also not forget that if Trump's party agreed to stronger gun laws they could be passed tomorrow.
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