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Post by Andrewlang on Apr 5, 2023 12:54:30 GMT
What'll really twist your melon is that I think we were looking to loan him to a vauxhall conference side. I saw a tweet from a Walsall fan reference an interview where Bennett said that was the initial plan for him, and that Walsall came out of the blue.
Andrew
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Post by El Goodo on Apr 5, 2023 12:57:56 GMT
Yup. Bonner's mentioned it before too – no one wanted to gamble on him because of his stature. That's why he ended up at Peterborough Sports initially despite it being well below his level.
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Post by amberisbackdrink on Apr 5, 2023 13:21:46 GMT
The loan spell at Walsall has definitely helped young Liam. He came back as more than a squad player and slotted into the First Team squad.
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lesj
Reserve team substitute
Posts: 2,586
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Post by lesj on Apr 5, 2023 13:31:59 GMT
He will be scoring goals next.
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Post by Andrewlang on Apr 5, 2023 13:35:07 GMT
Maybe after another loan.
Andrew
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Post by martinjohn on Apr 5, 2023 14:32:05 GMT
What'll really twist your melon is that I think we were looking to loan him to a vauxhall conference side. I saw a tweet from a Walsall fan reference an interview where Bennett said that was the initial plan for him, and that Walsall came out of the blue. Andrew Flipping heck!
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Post by martinjohn on Apr 5, 2023 14:43:43 GMT
So you're happy that one of our best players was out on loan for half a season? I'm happy that a good young player with excellent potential was loaned out to help him develop on and off the pitch in a move that everybody - his manager, coaches, other supporters and in particular the player himself – agrees was of huge benefit to him & made him a better player. Except you. Should we have loaned out Lloyd Jones to a bigger League 1 side then? Maybe Charlton or Bolton? This would have undoubtedly helped him develop as a player and would be a better player for it. What's the difference? And if your answer (as I suspect it will be) is that Bennett wasn't ready as a League 1 player in August then you're deluded. How could he not be ready in August but then is one of the first names on the team sheet from Jan onwards and regular MoM, two time player of the month etc. A judgement call was made in the summer than our squad needed players like Liam O'Neil, Greg Taylor, Brendan Haundstrup, Saiko Janneh and didn't need Liam Bennett. There's no other way of looking at it than saying this was a pretty obvious mistake. Clearly the management underestimated him (which I don't understand given his 5 league performances in 2022-23 season which included 2 MoM performances) and the blame lies with them. Of course Bennett benefited from being out on loan, but undoubtedly would have benefited more playing in League 1. Would we be better off than 23rd? The answer is completely hypothetical so not worth answering, but any manager should be putting their best starting 11 together and choosing from their best available squad, and this is a clear failing on part of the management this season. And just before I get jumped on by the snowflake Bonner obsessives: I support Bonner and want him to remain our manager even if we get relegated but I am willing (seemingly unlike some on here) to criticise him for mistakes he's made this season. The Lennett one is one of many - it's significance to our current league position is academic.
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Post by El Goodo on Apr 5, 2023 14:59:15 GMT
It's really, really, really simple, Martin: the judgment was made – by our manager, the one that picks the team – that Bennett was at a point that he needed to be starting games regularly, and that was more likely to happen at Walsall than here. That genuinely is the top and bottom of it.
As it worked out, injuries meant he probably would have got more minutes here than Bonner was originally anticipating. That's the way these things go sometimes, and if you asked Bonner whether he'd have loaned him out at that point knowing what was going to happen, the answer is very obviously going to be "no", in exactly the same way that if we'd kept him at the start of the season, hadn't suffered a massive injury crisis that led to us casting around for centre-backs, all 3 players that can play left-back being injured & necessitating a change of formation, and Bennett had made a few sub appearances and some Papa John's appearances, you'd be saying we should have loaned him out.
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Post by martinjohn on Apr 5, 2023 15:09:52 GMT
It's really, really, really simple, Martin: the judgment was made – by our manager, the one that picks the team – that Bennett was at a point that he needed to be starting games regularly, and that was more likely to happen at Walsall than here. As it worked out, injuries meant he probably would have got more minutes here than Bonner was originally anticipating. That's the way these things go sometimes, and if you asked Bonner whether he'd have loaned him out at that point knowing what was going to happen, the answer is very obviously going to be "no", in exactly the same way that if we'd kept him at the start of the season, hadn't suffered a massive injury crisis that led to us casting around for centre-backs, all 3 players that can play left-back being injured & necessitating a change of formation, and Bennett had made a few sub appearances and some Papa John's appearances, you'd be saying we should have loaned him out. It's really, really, really simple El Goodo: they shouldn't have loaned him out. The manager who picks the team can be criticised. It's a free country, it's OK to do it. And as a fan, I, and even you my friend, have the right to do so even if we don't have the experience or qualifications to match said manager. I know we've been going around in circles for months and months on this (and I'm as bored of it as anyone else) but here's my reason I would have kept him: 1) we're lacking in attack minded right sided players (and have been for years). Smith was played there a lot last season and it's not his natural position (although couldn't fault his effort there) and Tracey blew hot and cold there last season. 2) Bennett is versatile - we already knew he could play both left and right back. We also knew he could get forward so had potential to go left or right mid. If you've got a good player on your hands, especially with a manager who likes small squads - you should want someone like that around. 3) I cannot stress enough how well he did in the 5 league games he'd started. IF 'Bennett made a few sub appearances and some Papa John's appearances' that would have been a huge waste). I was one of many who were very surprised and disappointed that we loaned him out in August. My frustration at the decision doesn't come from hindsight - I already believed we had an excellent player on our hands who was ready for regular League 1 football. I'm not alone... but seemingly I'm heavily heavily outnumbered on this forum!
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Post by artvandelay on Apr 5, 2023 15:11:17 GMT
And once again it's February 2nd...
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Post by El Goodo on Apr 5, 2023 15:34:35 GMT
I was one of many who were very surprised and disappointed that we loaned him out in August. My frustration at the decision doesn't come from hindsight - I already believed we had an excellent player on our hands who was ready for regular League 1 football. I'm not alone... but seemingly I'm heavily heavily outnumbered on this forum! You see, the reason this one keeps running and running is because it's not even about whether it was the right or wrong thing to do, whether Bennett was ready or not, or whether you'd have done it or not; it's because you don't seem to acknowledge that it was a reasonable decision TO make, regardless of the fact that you wouldn't have made it. Given Bonner didn't think Bonner was going to play Bennett as much as he would be played on loan, do you think it was reasonable for Bonner to decide to loan him out?
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Post by Tom Shaw's Fist of Rage on Apr 5, 2023 15:37:36 GMT
If the number one reason is because he could do a job as a right sided attacker then we'll it's not an argument that's going to convince many given he's never played there and our system until recently never included a wingback or wide midfielder option, it's either been an inside forward like Mullin/Smith or a winger like Tracey.
The best argument is that he would have been a useful backup considering Okedina was mostly untested at RB.
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Post by martinjohn on Apr 5, 2023 15:39:12 GMT
I was one of many who were very surprised and disappointed that we loaned him out in August. My frustration at the decision doesn't come from hindsight - I already believed we had an excellent player on our hands who was ready for regular League 1 football. I'm not alone... but seemingly I'm heavily heavily outnumbered on this forum! You see, the reason this one keeps running and running is because it's not even about whether it was the right or wrong thing to do, whether Bennett was ready or not, or whether you'd have done it or not; it's because you don't seem to acknowledge that it was a reasonable decision TO make, regardless of the fact that you wouldn't have made it. What? I understand why they did it. I understand the reasons for it. I just think it was wrong... It's OK to disagree. It's healthy.
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Post by martinjohn on Apr 5, 2023 15:39:58 GMT
If the number one reason is because he could do a job as a right sided attacker then we'll it's not an argument that's going to convince many who's making that argument?
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Post by El Goodo on Apr 5, 2023 15:40:47 GMT
What? I understand why they did it. I understand the reasons for it. I just think it was wrong... It's OK to disagree. It's healthy. Excellent. As you were then.
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