EDL in Cambridge

[tedbaker79]

Jun 22, 2011 10:19:05 GMT Russ Greaves said:

Jun 21, 2011 20:39:56 GMT tedbaker79 said:

no comment

Is that on behalf of the EDL?

NO

You've made some anti-Islamic comments before. In the context of this thread, and it being on social chat, you're welcome to air your view.

LAST TIME I AIRED MY VIEW ON THIS SUBJECT YOU GAVE ME A WARNING WHICH IS WHY IVE SAID "NO COMMENT"

Will you be on the march?

NO I WILL BE ON THE PISS REGARDS TED

[orchardpark]

Jun 22, 2011 14:35:55 GMT MartinL said:

I live in Cambourne. They built a new church here. Are you suggesting they shouldn't have?

Hi Martin, I know of the church in Cambourne (I used to live next door to you!), isnt that an all faith sort of place?
My take on this whole thing, is that i am happy to live and bring up my children in a diverse community, i want all parts of it to co-exist. Some towns have been transformed by a very large influx of Muslims, is this is healthy for this country? I lived for a while in a large asian area in London. Grouped together for obvious reasons, religion being a major one.
was it a multicultural area, with people from many countries and backgrounds mixing easily? No it wasn't. Of course many were friendly.
Integration is vital for the future of this country.
Governments have swept this under the carpet and allowed the BNP to gain support in certain areas of the country. Other groups will follow as the BNP have dwindled. I do not see the EDL as the BNP, though i'm sure they attract some of that same support. The issue is for me is not who follows them, the message is many people are not happy with how this country is changing. It is not debated. Everyone hates the racist tag that gets thrown about whenever anything to do with race is aired.
It should be talked about. we should not be scared of it.

[Jerry1971]

Totally agree with a lot of what you've said Orchard Park, but it worries me that the EDL is just a newer version of the BNP and will end up driving the debate about issues of race and racial integration back to a slanging match between 'far-right' groups and 'anti-facist' groups - when in reality it should be, as you say, an open discussion between all interested parties.

Interesting to note from tonight's CEN that the EDL has both a jewish section and a homosexual section within its membership - I can't imagine the BNP would have stood for that somehow.

[MartinL]

You used to live next to me? Who are you? Only knew of one U's fan who was a neighbour and he left long before church was built.
Maybe the reason certains cultures/races/religions group together was/is the racism they encountered when they first came to this country. You're right it needs to be talked about but not with the vitriol that certain sectors spout. But what can we do about? Forcibly move people so that live in an area that is more diverse?
It seems that other religions do integrate better into British society than Muslims and I am sure there are many reasons for that. I don't have the answers but if we could all accept each others differences and embrace them, we would all live in a nicer world.
Maybe if we hadn't have gone round taking over the whole world "civilising" people and giving them British nationality it wouldn't be the problem it is today.

[MartinL]

"Interesting to note from tonight's CEN that the EDL has both a jewish section and a homosexual section within its membership - I can't imagine the BNP would have stood for that somehow."

Read more: cambridgeunitedfc.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=general&thread=1326&page=2#ixzz1Q1PzO2oq

I think it's a case of "my enemy's enemy is my friend"

[orchardpark]

Jun 22, 2011 15:58:30 GMT Jerry1971 said:

Totally agree with a lot of what you've said Orchard Park, but it worries me that the EDL is just a newer version of the BNP and will end up driving the debate about issues of race and racial integration back to a slanging match between 'far-right' groups and 'anti-facist' groups - when in reality it should be, as you say, an open discussion between all interested parties.

Interesting to note from tonight's CEN that the EDL has both a jewish section and a homosexual section within its membership - I can't imagine the BNP would have stood for that somehow.

Hopefully the fact that this issue is in the headlines enough will one day make it impossible for the political parties to ignore.
Its easy to shout fascist at anything that makes a noise about race issues.
I'm sure i would dislike in equal measure the EDL headbangers and the UAF brainwashed. I would like to speak to members of both sides though - would be interesting.
The fact that the EDL is talking about race issues will no doubt be enough for BNP types to want to be involved. they have tried to lose that image, but bald headed lads with a union jack will get only one sort of response in the press - true or not.

[dhpaul]

I'm with the view that all religions are dangerous, and irrelevant in this day and age, and would hope that this was obvious to anyone with even the most basic intelligence. I would oppose building any new place of worship, whatever the faith, as we should not be encouraging belief in nonsense.

I can understand why the building of a new mosque bothers people particularly. I have worked over the years with people of all religions, and have socialised with many of them. In this social context religion often comes up for discussion, and one thing I did find was that a muslim, even if an intelligent professional, cannot contemplate the question of whether or not there is a god. It is completely outside their mindset, and I believe it is because they are in effect brainwashed from birth. This is the worrying and dangerous aspect of Islam today.

I believe Christianity was probably of the same view a few hundred years ago. But it has moved on. I was brought up nominally a Christian, but realised in my primary school years that it was unlikely there was a god, and that therefore religion was essentially a fairy tale. Islam needs to move on in the same direction, but I won't hold my breath, at least in the short term.

[orchardpark]

Jun 22, 2011 16:07:13 GMT MartinL said:

You used to live next to me? Who are you? Only knew of one U's fan who was a neighbour and he left long before church was built.
Maybe the reason certains cultures/races/religions group together was/is the racism they encountered when they first came to this country. You're right it needs to be talked about but not with the vitriol that certain sectors spout. But what can we do about? Forcibly move people so that live in an area that is more diverse?
It seems that other religions do integrate better into British society than Muslims and I am sure there are many reasons for that. I don't have the answers but if we could all accept each others differences and embrace them, we would all live in a nicer world.
Maybe if we hadn't have gone round taking over the whole world "civilising" people and giving them British nationality it wouldn't be the problem it is today.

Hi Martin, yes its Jon. Moved out before the pub too!
The best way is to pick up the country and give it a good shake and hey presto we all mixed together.

[MartinL]

Thought it might be you. Hope all's well with you.

[bamberamber]

While I'd fully support tighter controls on immigration I'd not be marching with the EDL or BNP as a way of putting my point across. The flow of migrants both legal and illegal are not really helping this country.

Unemployment is high among the British population and before someone says "but the migrants do the jobs the Brits are too lazy to do" I'd like to point out that the majority of immigrants working in this country are paid well below the national minimum wage and therefore will always be employed ahead of someone with a national insurance number.

Also you have the issue of their wages being sent back to their home country, the loss of that money has a massive impact on tax revenue in Great Britain and when you take into account the level of healthcare and benefits that are available to them it really does set us back a fair wad of cash.

One of my dads friends was selling a car a while back and an eastern European man came to view it, he said I buy, I come back 3 hours. Sure enough a few hours later he came back with a cheque from a government department to help him buy the vehicle. This is the sort of thing that causes severe resentment among the native population.

I am very much a live and let live person when it comes to someone having a faith they adhere to as well, That's not to say I agree with any religions, in fact I think they are all just a load of old hocus pocus bullshit.

Multiculturalism has failed. Angela Merkel was one of the first politicians to openly state this fact, David Cameron has since claimed very similar. I feel they have a fairly valid point, cultures do not integrate on most levels. You just have to look at the Muslim communities, the Chinatown's and other areas where ethnic minorities congregate to form their own segregated communities.

My limited understanding of the Islamic faith is that world domination via their religion is their ultimate aim, I believe as much is stated in the Qur'an although I cannot find an exact translation of it. Whilst a religion has aims of taking over the world it's hardly going to go down very well with other religions and non believers alike.

Many people (including some practicing Muslims) believe that their religion is archaic and far too unadapted to modern life, the arguement there would be that if a religion is changed to make it more 21st century then you're not following the scriptures and are in breach of your own religions teachings.

There is no quick fix, in fact to be honest I think that eventually race riots and possibly civil war are inevitable. Time will tell and I may be proved to be completely wrong.

I hope this makes sense, it did in my head as I was typing.

[warren62]

Sort out the Macho "British and pround " knuckle draggers, their simpleton jeremy kyle watching partners with numerous children from numerous men, living on benefits in council sink estates then watch EDL supprt dwindle - immigrants are prepared to work for a lower wage , until benefits are cut and people encouraged to actually get off their backsides and work foreigners will always find a place in this country , they dont take british jobs , brits wont take them for themselves because the system makes it easy for them not to.

[Jerry1971]

Bravo Bamber! At last we are having a balanced debate here.

What is so sad is that a large portion (actually a very overwhelming portion) of the muslim world abhor the actions of the tiny minority who wish to see English natives wearing veils and being beheaded or stoned for adultery, or who like to blow up tube trains. But until islam gets into the real World with some of its teaching nothing will change, and disproportionate resentment toward muslims will continue. Some self-help in order here.

[Jerry1971]

Jun 22, 2011 17:18:34 GMT warren62 said:

Sort out the Macho "British and pround " knuckle draggers, their simpleton jeremy kyle watching partners with numerous children from numerous men, living on benefits in council sink estates then watch EDL supprt dwindle - immigrants are prepared to work for a lower wage , until benefits are cut and people encouraged to actually get off their backsides and work foreigners will always find a place in this country , they dont take british jobs , brits wont take them for themselves because the system makes it easy for them not to.

And..... Bravo Warren! Nail-head, squarely, wallop.

Personally I'd use the site on Mill Road to build a large workhouse to get some of the feckless spongers in our society 'mentally adjusted' to taking some responsibility for themselves and for their disfunctional and expensive (to us at least) families.

[Russ Greaves]

Jun 22, 2011 16:16:30 GMT dhpaul said:

I'm with the view that all religions are dangerous, and irrelevant in this day and age, and would hope that this was obvious to anyone with even the most basic intelligence. I would oppose building any new place of worship, whatever the faith, as we should not be encouraging belief in nonsense.

I can understand why the building of a new mosque bothers people particularly. I have worked over the years with people of all religions, and have socialised with many of them. In this social context religion often comes up for discussion, and one thing I did find was that a muslim, even if an intelligent professional, cannot contemplate the question of whether or not there is a god. It is completely outside their mindset, and I believe it is because they are in effect brainwashed from birth. This is the worrying and dangerous aspect of Islam today.

I believe Christianity was probably of the same view a few hundred years ago. But it has moved on. I was brought up nominally a Christian, but realised in my primary school years that it was unlikely there was a god, and that therefore religion was essentially a fairy tale. Islam needs to move on in the same direction, but I won't hold my breath, at least in the short term.

I certainly share your views on religion. It is an absurd anachronism and I can only hope that the advance of reason and science will continue to push religion towards the periphery.

There's no place in this day and age for religious superstition and the dogma it produces.

It may take a few hundred years yet, but I'm sure humanity will outgrow religion. It's a stain on human history.

[El Goodo]

Nah, religion will never die. I believe I'm correct in saying that faith is on the rise throughout the vast majority of the world. It's only really in the UK, American and a few other developed European states that it's declining.