squibbon
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Post by squibbon on Aug 29, 2019 19:48:34 GMT
Well it is the Remainers that speak with certainty about the consequences of any sort of Brexit, never mind a no deal one. That certainty should give all Remainers an advantage and be able to capitalise first. It shouldn’t need a Leaver to point out what those opportunities are. Hah, classic Brexit doublespeak Brexiter: Brexit will create loads of opportunities! Everyone one else: Can you tell us what they are? Brexiter: You should already know what they are, stupid remoaners, stop trying to talk Britain down and be positive! Cambcam, judging from your other post you seem like a reasonable sort - do you not think the economic argument for brexit is bogus? It seems to me any benefit is a long way off and far from guaranteed. I get it (sort of) from a sovereignty point of view, but I always think it's dishonest of leavers to pretend it will make us better off any time soon. Jacob Rees Mogg on Radio 5 this morning said that food and clothing would be cheaper as soon as we left with no deal. As in the next morning. He is either lying or completely bonkers. Or maybe a mixture of both.
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lesj
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Post by lesj on Aug 29, 2019 21:16:26 GMT
The thing is , a lot of the remainers are not old enough to know what Great Britain was like before 1972. I am . It was a far better place then than now .
The trouble with the remainers that are in high places are purposely exaggerating what things will be like after leaving the E.U to try and get there own way.
Yes I do believe we will be worse off in the begining after leaving the E.U, but in the long term I am sure we will be much better of.
A neighbour of mine was saying only this week-end Germany to start with will still want to do business with us.
Look at the cars they sell here without anything else. VW to start with, their Golf & their Polo cars are always in the top 10 selling cars in the country, then they have Audi, Porshe, Bentley . they also own Skoda & Seat.
Mercedes also sell a lot of cars here. BMW sell a lot of cars & motorcycles here. They also own the Mini that sells well here, plus they also own Rolls-Royce That's just cars . Then there is Miele, Bosch, Sebo to name just a few companies they will not want to loose that business. And I'm sure that the trade that we do with China, Korea & Japan will not be affected when we leave the E.U .
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Mark of Carnage
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Post by Mark of Carnage on Aug 30, 2019 7:13:24 GMT
The thing is , a lot of the remainers are not old enough to know what Great Britain was like before 1972. I am . It was a far better place then than now . The trouble with the remainers that are in high places are purposely exaggerating what things will be like after leaving the E.U to try and get there own way. Yes I do believe we will be worse off in the begining after leaving the E.U, but in the long term I am sure we will be much better of. A neighbour of mine was saying only this week-end Germany to start with will still want to do business with us. Look at the cars they sell here without anything else. VW to start with, their Golf & their Polo cars are always in the top 10 selling cars in the country, then they have Audi, Porshe, Bentley . they also own Skoda & Seat. Mercedes also sell a lot of cars here. BMW sell a lot of cars & motorcycles here. They also own the Mini that sells well here, plus they also own Rolls-Royce That's just cars . Then there is Miele, Bosch, Sebo to name just a few companies they will not want to loose that business. And I'm sure that the trade that we do with China, Korea & Japan will not be affected when we leave the E.U . WTO tariff rates on cars are 10% but on things like dairy products they are as high as 35%. In the event of no deal the UK is planning to use WTO MFN (most favoured nation) rules to lower tariffs equally for all WTO members to zero as a temporary measure while it sorts out trade deals and this will of course mean zero tariffs not only for the EU but for states like USA, Brazil and Australia as all WTO member states have to be treated equally. Although on the face of it this sounds good, it doesn't work both ways and it's up to each WTO member to lower tariffs as they please within sectors. lowering tariffs to zero will likely keep imports flowing into the uk but is likely to be devestating for uk exports and put us at a massive disadvantage in negotiating trade deals as where's the incentive for the other side to deal if we are already letting them in for free while they can charge us full WTO rates on our exports. Trump will be on cloud nine. To enable us to export the uk government intends to compensate whole sectors with grants to cover the tariffs adding enormously to the national debt. We can avoid all this by having a deal with the EU by 31/10/19 that will allow us to remain in the customs union for a temporary period after we leave the EU while we negotiate a trade deal with the EU. Hopefully the EU will rebrand the backstop as bojos backside so we are able to get that deal before 31/10/19. As I have said continually on this thread, this isn't about leaving or remaing, it's about deal or no deal. The problem I and many others have including many pro leave is that we do not believe Bojo really intends to make a deal and cannot go along with his high risk shenanagans. It is pretty clear he would be happy to go no deal because he puts party above country and his prime concern is to steal the clothes of the brexit party to avoid a split in the vote at the general election that we all know is looming. He knows the only way he can thwart the brexit party is by leaving the EU without a deal on 31/10/19. Getting a deal is vital to our national interests. Consumers are likely to be insulated from most of the economic damage in the short term by massive bojo fiscal give away sweeteners but make no mistake our economy will be hit by a tsunami when we go no deal and no deal is sh*t or bust.
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Post by furiousgeorge on Aug 30, 2019 9:47:40 GMT
The thing is , a lot of the remainers are not old enough to know what Great Britain was like before 1972. I am . It was a far better place then than now . The trouble with the remainers that are in high places are purposely exaggerating what things will be like after leaving the E.U to try and get there own way. Yes I do believe we will be worse off in the begining after leaving the E.U, but in the long term I am sure we will be much better of. A neighbour of mine was saying only this week-end Germany to start with will still want to do business with us. Look at the cars they sell here without anything else. VW to start with, their Golf & their Polo cars are always in the top 10 selling cars in the country, then they have Audi, Porshe, Bentley . they also own Skoda & Seat. Mercedes also sell a lot of cars here. BMW sell a lot of cars & motorcycles here. They also own the Mini that sells well here, plus they also own Rolls-Royce That's just cars . Then there is Miele, Bosch, Sebo to name just a few companies they will not want to loose that business. And I'm sure that the trade that we do with China, Korea & Japan will not be affected when we leave the E.U . good god. I mean its literally brexiteer bingo.
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moose
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Post by moose on Aug 30, 2019 10:15:50 GMT
The thing is , a lot of the remainers are not old enough to know what Great Britain was like before 1972. I am . It was a far better place then than now . The trouble with the remainers that are in high places are purposely exaggerating what things will be like after leaving the E.U to try and get there own way. Yes I do believe we will be worse off in the begining after leaving the E.U, but in the long term I am sure we will be much better of. A neighbour of mine was saying only this week-end Germany to start with will still want to do business with us. Look at the cars they sell here without anything else. VW to start with, their Golf & their Polo cars are always in the top 10 selling cars in the country, then they have Audi, Porshe, Bentley . they also own Skoda & Seat. Mercedes also sell a lot of cars here. BMW sell a lot of cars & motorcycles here. They also own the Mini that sells well here, plus they also own Rolls-Royce That's just cars . Then there is Miele, Bosch, Sebo to name just a few companies they will not want to loose that business. And I'm sure that the trade that we do with China, Korea & Japan will not be affected when we leave the E.U . The UK was a very different place in 1972, I'm not sure that it was 'better' though. Standards of living were lower for starters. What measure are you using? Also, please stop promulgating these myths about the German car industry. They were debunked three years ago if you cared to look into it. However much the German car industry may want a deal, Germany cannot negotiate a bilateral agreement with the UK. Interesting that you mention BMW, are you aware that it has already moved some production out of the UK due to Brexit fears?: www.theguardian.com/business/2019/jul/09/bmw-engine-production-uk-brexit-fearsAnd that just the FEAR of Brexit, imagine if it actually came to pass! As regards Japan, our trade deal is through the EU so trade with Japan WILL be affected. Liam Fox has already confirmed that there will not be time to replicate that deal prior to exit: www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47319533
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Zinedine
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Post by Zinedine on Aug 30, 2019 10:23:43 GMT
The thing is , a lot of the remainers are not old enough to know what Great Britain was like before 1972. I am . It was a far better place then than now . The trouble with the remainers that are in high places are purposely exaggerating what things will be like after leaving the E.U to try and get there own way. Yes I do believe we will be worse off in the begining after leaving the E.U, but in the long term I am sure we will be much better of. A neighbour of mine was saying only this week-end Germany to start with will still want to do business with us. Look at the cars they sell here without anything else. VW to start with, their Golf & their Polo cars are always in the top 10 selling cars in the country, then they have Audi, Porshe, Bentley . they also own Skoda & Seat. Mercedes also sell a lot of cars here. BMW sell a lot of cars & motorcycles here. They also own the Mini that sells well here, plus they also own Rolls-Royce That's just cars . Then there is Miele, Bosch, Sebo to name just a few companies they will not want to loose that business. And I'm sure that the trade that we do with China, Korea & Japan will not be affected when we leave the E.U . Hi Les, curious about how Britain was a far better place in 1972 - can you expand? How does that relate to EU membership? As for the German car manufacturers coming to save us; British imports of German cars dropped 3.8 per from 2016-2017 (last reported figures I can find online) whereas Chinese, Japanese and Indian markets are all growing significantly - I wonder where they'll be focusing their attention? www.vda.de/en/services/facts-and-figures/annual-figures/exports.html
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lesj
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Post by lesj on Aug 30, 2019 10:57:06 GMT
Well, to start with we had a thriving car & motorcycle industry. That has gone now. I admit it wasn't all down to E.U some of it was down to strikes. There have been many restrictions imposed upon us by the E.U.( ok some of them good for health reasons but many ridiculous). One that immediately comes to mind, years ago there was a restriction on the amount of dairy herds we were aloud, so farmers around here were forced to sell their herds. As for companies moving abroad, it is nothing new, for instance Dyson moved out years ago
Now I am not saying that I want a no deal. I don't
I do despair that Boris is steering this ship, but then I do not think that Corbyn would be any better.
I think that we all have to agree that at the moment the country is in a mess & it's going to take some time to get out of it whether we get a deal or not.
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moose
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Post by moose on Aug 30, 2019 12:12:06 GMT
Well, to start with we had a thriving car & motorcycle industry. That has gone now. I admit it wasn't all down to E.U some of it was down to strikes. There have been many restrictions imposed upon us by the E.U.( ok some of them good for health reasons but many ridiculous). One that immediately comes to mind, years ago there was a restriction on the amount of dairy herds we were aloud, so farmers around here were forced to sell their herds. As for companies moving abroad, it is nothing new for instance Dyson moved out years ago Now I am not saying that I want a no deal. I don't I do despair that Boris is steering this ship, but then I do not think that Corbyn would be any better. I think that we all have to agree that at the moment the country is in a mess & it's going to take some time to get out of it whether we get a deal or not. What cow herd restriction are you referring to? I see no evidence that the EU has done this to control herd numbers. Yes, Dyson moved out recently (despite James Dyson being a Brexiteer). The difference is that BMW would not have done it but for Brexit. No Brexit, no loss of BMW business.
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lesj
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Post by lesj on Aug 30, 2019 12:17:05 GMT
"What cow herd restriction are you referring to? I see no evidence that the EU has done this to control herd numbers."
Perhaps you should delve back a bit further, we have been a member of the E.U for 47 years.
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moose
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Post by moose on Aug 30, 2019 12:33:55 GMT
"What cow herd restriction are you referring to? I see no evidence that the EU has done this to control herd numbers." Perhaps you should delve back a bit further, we have been a member of the E.U for 47 years. To when exactly? I’m just looking for some evidence to support your claim.
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lesj
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Post by lesj on Aug 30, 2019 12:47:49 GMT
It was a long time ago, I obviously cannot remember when . I remember a farmer in the village saying after he had to sell his dairy herd that when he first had to start buying milk it tasted sour to him . He had always been used to drinking the milk shortly after leaving the cow.
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moose
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Post by moose on Aug 30, 2019 13:13:40 GMT
It was a long time ago, I obviously cannot remember when . I remember a farmer in the village saying after he had to sell his dairy herd that when he first had to start buying milk it tasted sour to him . He had always been used to drinking the milk shortly after leaving the cow. So the one example of ‘ridiculous EU restrictions’ that you choose to cite relates to limits on cow herds, but you can’t remember when and there’s no public evidence to support? It would be funny if it weren’t for the mess the country’s in.
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neilmc4
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Post by neilmc4 on Aug 30, 2019 14:05:33 GMT
Still not as good as the Boris fan during the Tory leadership campaign......
"Why have you voted for Boris?" "Because he'll Make Britain Great Again!" (*alarm bells and sirens go off immediately) "So when in history would you say Britain was at its greatest?" "Easy. 1940 - when we stood alone against the whole of Europe"
We really are completely and utterly screwed.
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nutsaboutamber
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Post by nutsaboutamber on Aug 30, 2019 15:27:29 GMT
The thing is , a lot of the remainers are not old enough to know what Great Britain was like before 1972. I am . It was a far better place then than now . The trouble with the remainers that are in high places are purposely exaggerating what things will be like after leaving the E.U to try and get there own way. Yes I do believe we will be worse off in the begining after leaving the E.U, but in the long term I am sure we will be much better of. A neighbour of mine was saying only this week-end Germany to start with will still want to do business with us. Look at the cars they sell here without anything else. VW to start with, their Golf & their Polo cars are always in the top 10 selling cars in the country, then they have Audi, Porshe, Bentley . they also own Skoda & Seat. Mercedes also sell a lot of cars here. BMW sell a lot of cars & motorcycles here. They also own the Mini that sells well here, plus they also own Rolls-Royce That's just cars . Then there is Miele, Bosch, Sebo to name just a few companies they will not want to loose that business. And I'm sure that the trade that we do with China, Korea & Japan will not be affected when we leave the E.U . Les, so you’ve lived in this complete arsehole of an island since 1972 under protest? What goes that say about you then?
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Andrewlang
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Post by Andrewlang on Aug 30, 2019 17:19:30 GMT
"So the one example of ‘ridiculous EU restrictions’ that you choose to cite relates to limits on cow herds, but you can’t remember when and there’s no public evidence to support? It would be funny if it weren’t for the mess the country’s in"
This *might* be true, though far from being a ridiculous restriction I think it's more to do with animal welfare and how many you can keep per acre.
Andrew
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