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Post by kentishu on Sept 19, 2020 22:06:12 GMT
I am struggling to understand why someone who could easily have died from Covid thinks that the medical adviser is scaremongering. It doesn't make sense. He's also just an adviser, it's the politicians that take the decisions.
Apologies for the rather flippant remark but it's people with your point of view who are more likely to take risks and end up catching the disease.
Kentish
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hersey
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Post by hersey on Sept 20, 2020 8:24:14 GMT
A medical bloke is aleays going to cover his arse by erring on the side of caution. And he has nothing to lose. If we lockdown, the country going bankrupt- and let's not kid ourselves, we can't keep shutting everything and avoid that happening - isn't his problem. If it works, he's a genius, if it doesn't work , we didn't do it long enough or well enough.
Boris is a bit like a football manager who's told by a physio not to play hos striker because his knee hurts. He has to decide whether it's worth the risk of chucking him on for the last 20 minutes to get a vital goal. Not that we have to worry about that as we're on target to finish with 138 points and a goal difference of 184-0
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hersey
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Post by hersey on Sept 20, 2020 8:25:48 GMT
Should finish the season now and do it on points per game average. Thia is the obvious way forward. It was bound to come from a Dave. One day everyone will be called Dave
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Post by madmarvin on Sept 20, 2020 8:38:08 GMT
Whitty is not running the country. That would be Dominic Cummings.
Nobody voted for him either.
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Post by ilovechadders on Sept 20, 2020 12:00:02 GMT
Whitty is not running the country. That would be Dominic Cummings. Nobody voted for him either. In all fairness he has sensibly given us guidance on how to check out our eyesight during periods of lockdown.
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Post by abington2 on Sept 20, 2020 17:31:35 GMT
Can we survive financially and see the season out without taking any money on the gate?
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Post by treadmore on Sept 20, 2020 17:51:49 GMT
Can we survive financially and see the season out without taking any money on the gate? Dunno but I'd be really interested in seeing what we get from ifollow compared to what we made from traditional ticket sales. I guess our match day costs are lower but then we're not making money on programmes, food & drink & hospitality etc.
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Wingco's Boy
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Post by Wingco's Boy on Sept 20, 2020 18:10:15 GMT
Whitty is not running the country. That would be Dominic Cummings. Nobody voted for him either. Seriously? Whitty calls all the shots that count right now. Cummings is steadily and correctly getting rid of Remainer civil servant heads. That's right up his street, that sort of thing. And it doesn't wreck the economy. Whitty/Johnson are causing irreparable damage right now. And I'm someone who considered Johnson a hero until very recently.
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Wingco's Boy
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Post by Wingco's Boy on Sept 20, 2020 18:17:07 GMT
I am struggling to understand why someone who could easily have died from Covid thinks that the medical adviser is scaremongering. It doesn't make sense. He's also just an adviser, it's the politicians that take the decisions. Apologies for the rather flippant remark but it's people with your point of view who are more likely to take risks and end up catching the disease. Kentish Oh really, come on! Dhpaul could have caught sepsis and been seriously ill, or west nile fever, or ebola, or even seasonal flu. YET HE WOULDN'T WANT TO HAVE THE ECONOMY RUINED TO TRY AND PREVENT THESE RISKS. WHAT'S SO BLOODY SPECIAL ABOUT COVID THAT HAS ABSOLUTELY DECIMATED THE POPULATION WITH ITS MONSTROUS 0.07% DEATH RATE? Sorry for the capitals, but some of us despair for the nation's sanity.
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Post by madmarvin on Sept 20, 2020 20:27:36 GMT
I am struggling to understand why someone who could easily have died from Covid thinks that the medical adviser is scaremongering. It doesn't make sense. He's also just an adviser, it's the politicians that take the decisions. Apologies for the rather flippant remark but it's people with your point of view who are more likely to take risks and end up catching the disease. Kentish but some of us despair for the nation's sanity. I can't disagree with that bit although not for the same reasons
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Mark of Carnage
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Post by Mark of Carnage on Sept 20, 2020 21:52:08 GMT
I am struggling to understand why someone who could easily have died from Covid thinks that the medical adviser is scaremongering. It doesn't make sense. He's also just an adviser, it's the politicians that take the decisions. Apologies for the rather flippant remark but it's people with your point of view who are more likely to take risks and end up catching the disease. Kentish Oh really, come on! Dhpaul could have caught sepsis and been seriously ill, or west nile fever, or ebola, or even seasonal flu. YET HE WOULDN'T WANT TO HAVE THE ECONOMY RUINED TO TRY AND PREVENT THESE RISKS. WHAT'S SO BLOODY SPECIAL ABOUT COVID THAT HAS ABSOLUTELY DECIMATED THE POPULATION WITH ITS MONSTROUS 0.07% DEATH RATE? Sorry for the capitals, but some of us despair for the nation's sanity. I think it is wrong to conclude the mortality rate is as low as 0.07% ths early in the pandemic. We simply don't know but I think closer to 0.5% is far more likely to be apparent in several years time when the data becomes clearer. Of course the hope is for a vaccine but even if we have that, the mortality rate will surely be far higher than 0.07%. We know that since early August increased availability of testing has resulted in a far greater proportion of positives amongst people under 75 and even under 50 and that is hardly surprising after the pubs were given the green light on 4/7/20 and the 'eat out to help the virus' scheme. With kids now back at school and colleges and test and trace morphing into the track a trace system it's not looking good as we come into the Autumn. To count as a covid mortality death has to occur from any causes within 28 days of a positive test. A report from Oxford Uni on 21/8/20 established that of those that die within 2 months the mean average mortality occurs on day 26.8 with a standard deviation of 12.4 days. We know the risk of death is far lower for under 50s and you can surmise that younger people that die from covid tend to last longer than the mean average and so relative to older people even less than they argubly should in the ONS stats the government uses. Of course there is also a time lag of weeks from infection to hospitalisation and death that will not appear in the ONS stats for a few weeks so the 60k that had the infection last week will not be representative of the mortality rate for at least a month. All causes mortality rates in the UK are shown by ONS to be pretty stable compared to the 5 year average for under 75s but that misses the point. It's the over 75s whose population will almost certainly be decimated by covid. Broadly speaking, this age group is very likely to be taking much more precautions than other age groups and that will be keeping the infection rate amongst this group down for the time being. However, it is inevitable as infection rates increase in the general population that this group will be hit again with deaths as it was throughout April and early May. There are already signs of this with increased reporting of residential care homes being struck by the virus. When the virus hits a residential care home it goes through the residents like wildfire causing multiple deaths. There are 5.4 million over 75s in the Uk. We don't know yet how high the mortality rate is for older people but we know it is significantly higher than for other age groups and we know that for the 1.6 million who are over 85 it is higher still. I think the priority should be saving lives. Of course there is a cost to the economy. Whatever we do now we are headed for mother of economic slumps and there will be winners and losers but borrowing is currently cheap and combine that with some modest tax rises and the slump we are entering can be managed. We are the 5th largest economy in the world and now that we have left the EU it's time to flex our muscles. We are a very wealthy nation and we can well afford to look after all our people.
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Post by haptogob on Sept 20, 2020 22:51:34 GMT
I am struggling to understand why someone who could easily have died from Covid thinks that the medical adviser is scaremongering. It doesn't make sense. He's also just an adviser, it's the politicians that take the decisions. Apologies for the rather flippant remark but it's people with your point of view who are more likely to take risks and end up catching the disease. Kentish Oh really, come on! Dhpaul could have caught sepsis and been seriously ill, or west nile fever, or ebola, or even seasonal flu. YET HE WOULDN'T WANT TO HAVE THE ECONOMY RUINED TO TRY AND PREVENT THESE RISKS. WHAT'S SO BLOODY SPECIAL ABOUT COVID THAT HAS ABSOLUTELY DECIMATED THE POPULATION WITH ITS MONSTROUS 0.07% DEATH RATE? Sorry for the capitals, but some of us despair for the nation's sanity. I am primarily concerned with my sanity and I know that I have relied on the Abbey for many years to help me release the pressures of my everyday life and thus maintain sanity. I am seriously concerned that my release valve has been closed and I fear fopmy sanity and for my and others mental well being the longer stadiums are locked down.
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Post by kettlewitch on Sept 21, 2020 6:09:21 GMT
Oh really, come on! Dhpaul could have caught sepsis and been seriously ill, or west nile fever, or ebola, or even seasonal flu. YET HE WOULDN'T WANT TO HAVE THE ECONOMY RUINED TO TRY AND PREVENT THESE RISKS. WHAT'S SO BLOODY SPECIAL ABOUT COVID THAT HAS ABSOLUTELY DECIMATED THE POPULATION WITH ITS MONSTROUS 0.07% DEATH RATE? Sorry for the capitals, but some of us despair for the nation's sanity. I am primarily concerned with my sanity and I know that I have relied on the Abbey for many years to help me release the pressures of my everyday life and thus maintain sanity. I am seriously concerned that my release valve has been closed and I fear fopmy sanity and for my and others mental well being the longer stadiums are locked down. It is good that you have raised this important and serious concern. Very many of us will be similarly affected by these enforced changes to our usual lives, whether we recognise and acknowledge it or not. We all need to take care of ourselves, our families, friends, colleagues, neighbours and be prepared to ask someone whether they are OK no matter how uncomfortable we may feel feel doing that. Just opening the door to a conversation may be all that someone needs in the first instance. I hope you can find something to act as a temporary release valve while we wait.
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Post by haptogob on Sept 21, 2020 7:20:08 GMT
Thank for your encouragement and holding that door ajar. I'm feeling quite down this morning and am hoping some of us may be able to attend a live match this weekend but I expect live sport to be a csualty of whatever scheme the government has dreamt up to try and head off this second spike that is clearly on the way, mybe we will hear something today.
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andyrt
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Post by andyrt on Sept 21, 2020 7:45:58 GMT
‘I think the priority should be saving lives. Of course there is a cost to the economy. Whatever we do now we are headed for mother of economic slumps and there will be winners and losers but borrowing is currently cheap and combine that with some modest tax rises and the slump we are entering can be managed. We are the 5th largest economy in the world and now that we have left the EU it's time to flex our muscles. We are a very wealthy nation and we can well afford to look after all our people.’
From saying the priority should be saving lives, you go on to casually say there will be winners and losers. I presume you think it’s okay to ‘sustain collateral damage’?
Is it all about ‘saving lives’ from the threat of the virus? What about the deaths the lockdown has contributed to?
Your concern for the over 75’s does seem a tad disingenuous. I presume from your ‘flexing our muscles’ comment you are a support of the current political system and the current regime. A regime that, in the short term, allowed infected and untested people to return to care homes. In the long term has no real interest in a class of people are no longer productive and no use to the money making machine.
Why for the first time in history is the policy to isolate the healthy and not the vulnerable? This virus will have its way, and trying to lock it down will just delay the inevitable. The government should gave followed the Swedish model, and also taken more care of the vulnerable.
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